FOT Forum
The Best Show on WFMU => Dear Tom => Topic started by: Andy on November 26, 2007, 10:41:17 PM
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Tom-
Why is the new Wu tang album so great?
And who is your favorite member?
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IN MIAMI ON JAN. 25 GOT MY TIX TODAY
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Tom (and every other board reader),
Have you gone over to www.loud.com to download the Wu-Tang endorsed and completely free Mix tape? I love it soooooo much. I can't wait for the new album.
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Awesome - thanks for this, Gagneaux.
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you did it again, you did it again...
Ghostface Killa did it again.
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you did it again, you did it again...
Ghostface Killa did it again.
Do you like the new Wu more than the new Ghostface? Ive decided to hold off on listening to Big Doe until I actually buy it.
BTW: Not sure how many Friends of Tom are friends of Scarface but his new album is pretty great too.
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early on I like the new Ghostface a little better, but really, is any individual Wu Tang member's album really that different that an official Wu Tang album?
I need to check out Scarface. I used to love him and didn't know he was still putting stuff out.
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early on I like the new Ghostface a little better, but really, is any individual Wu Tang member's album really that different that an official Wu Tang album?
With Ghostface as of late, I think he's definitely his own entity. Though his sound is still Wu at its root, his albums are no longer overflowing with Wu guest appearances which is bad news for second/third string Clan affiliates (somewhere, Remedy is crying).
I need to check out Scarface. I used to love him and didn't know he was still putting stuff out.
Definitely get the new Scarface. It's the same Scarface you loved from back in the day. It's his first album since The Fix which had the song "Guess Who's Back" with Jay and Beans produced by Kanye aka "One of My Fav Hip Hop Songs Ever". Id marry it if I though I had a chance with it.
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The new Wu and the Ghostface both suck.
You indie rock people should be after more challenging fare if you're gonna listen to hiphop.
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The new Wu and the Ghostface both suck.
You indie rock people should be after more challenging fare if you're gonna listen to hiphop.
what should we be listening to?
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The new Wu and the Ghostface both suck.
You indie rock people should be after more challenging fare if you're gonna listen to hiphop.
what should we be listening to?
I'm glad you asked
http://www.myspace.com/franktherobottank
Saul Williams has been doing some interesting stuff, K-OS out of Canada
Hell Razah just put out an album to zero fanfare.
Heck I don't even know I'm too busy listening to the older stuff to even pay too much attention to the scene. But I'm sure there is good stuff out there if you look. Anything but this same old rigmarole.
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This is a big problem with hip hop. I'm not looking to slam you, Ason, but there's some massive resistance to letting a hip hop artist develop over the long run and build a catalog and a career. What should Ghostface do, shoot himself because he's been around for more than five years? He's been in the game three years less than Jeff Tweedy, but nobody's asking for his retirement.
Most of the hip hop I buy is indie stuff, for the record, so it's not like I don't know that there's a whole world out there. (Unfortunately I don't have edited versions, so they are not a big part of the Best Show). But I don't dump on guys like Ghost or Jay-Z just because they're still doing it.
Let the guys in their 30's do their thing, son.
Tom.
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Having worked security and stage management for a number of mid-level (high 500-capacity) hip hop shows over the past year and a half, these shows tend to be something to dread due to the crowds the artists draw (at least in the greater Boston area). The performers are usually cool, but the crowd... after a couple of bad ones, I ALWAYS go to work seriously wondering if I am going to make it home alive. Lest I be interpreted as racist, I should state upfront that a) I am white and b) so are the VAST majority of the genuine thugs and suburban wannabes who buy tickets for these shows. I enjoy real hip hop from a record, but the pervasive ugliness in a live context -- a bunch of dudes bragging about all the caine they've slang, women they've disrespected, guns they've shot, people they've maimed/killed, and, if it's a rap battle, how much of a homosexual their opponent is -- has ruined any appreciation I had of live renditions of the genre. It makes me sad in the same way hardcore did in the mid- to late-1990s when idiot, violence prone, gang-oriented fans (again, most of them white) couldn't control themselves and rendered a legitimate entertainment form illigitimate by leaving a bunch of forced-out-of-business live entertainment venues in their stupid fucking wake. It's only going to be a matter of months before something really bad happens and hip hop gets shut out of the legitimate live entertainment business for good. From what I have seen, it deserves nothing less. RIP, you fucks. You earned it.
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Boston ruins everything.
Tom.
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He's been in the game three years less than Jeff Tweedy, but nobody's asking for his retirement.
Tom.
I hereby call for Jeff Tweedy to retire.
But then again, I'm a Jay Farrar Man myself. Through and through.
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Boston ruins everything.
Tom.
It's true. I don't want to jump on the anti-Boston bandwagon, as I've had a great time every time I've been there, and I largely resent NY these days anyway, but I just had a long conversation with a friend who is a lifelong Boston native and a columnist for the Globe about 7 Seconds' "The Crew." I grew up loving that song and album for the feeling of belonging it gave me, however illusory, but to him it represented everything thuggish and evil about hardcore. Eventually he conceded that growing up in Boston, where there were real crews who routinely beat people up, forever ruined the song and concept for him, while for me, growing up in Jersey (and moving to a different town every couple of years, which is the worst of all possible worlds), the whole idea helped me deal with all that suburban alienation stuff.
I would like it, however, if every single person featured on a 92.3 K-Rock poster or billboard would retire, effecitve immediately (for non NY/NJ-ers, these include The Red Hot Chili Peppers, Green Day, The Foo Fighters, Opie & Anthony, Pearl Jam, and probably some others I'm forgetting).
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Boston ruins everything.
Tom.
It's true. I don't want to jump on the anti-Boston bandwagon, as I've had a great time every time I've been there, and I largely resent NY these days anyway, but I just had a long conversation with a friend who is a lifelong Boston native and a columnist for the Globe about 7 Seconds' "The Crew." I grew up loving that song and album for the feeling of belonging it gave me, however illusory, but to him it represented everything thuggish and evil about hardcore. Eventually he conceded that growing up in Boston, where there were real crews who routinely beat people up, forever ruined the song and concept for him, while for me, growing up in Jersey (and moving to a different town every couple of years, which is the worst of all possible worlds), the whole idea helped me deal with all that suburban alienation stuff.
I would like it, however, if every single person featured on a 92.3 K-Rock poster or billboard would retire, effecitve immediately (for non NY/NJ-ers, these include The Red Hot Chili Peppers, Green Day, The Foo Fighters, Opie & Anthony, Pearl Jam, and probably some others I'm forgetting).
7 seconds is thuggish??
your friend better not come to Newbridge or he'll get barged by Hammerhead
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The new Wu and the Ghostface both suck.
You indie rock people should be after more challenging fare if you're gonna listen to hiphop.
what should we be listening to?
I'm glad you asked
http://www.myspace.com/franktherobottank
Saul Williams has been doing some interesting stuff, K-OS out of Canada
Hell Razah just put out an album to zero fanfare.
Heck I don't even know I'm too busy listening to the older stuff to even pay too much attention to the scene. But I'm sure there is good stuff out there if you look. Anything but this same old rigmarole.
i'm glad you asked....your comment is so pompous i think it's probably a joke, so excuse me for seriously responding to it seriously if so. first of all, claiming that saul williams and k-os are doing more prolific work than wu tang, ghostface, jay z automatically disqualifies (or at least discredits) you from critiquing anything hip hop. saul williams has been floundering for years. k-os has done some nice work, but has done so little for hip hop in comparison to these other guys you seemingly slam, because they've taken more press. they're not even doing to same type of work first of all. sounds like you dig the posi stuff rather than street. if that's the issue, just say so.
i did a little college radio show ason. i've seen plenty of people who rep unknowns, sometimes it's justified, sometimes not. this time, your guys don't even count as unknowns, and its totally unjustified.
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This is a big problem with hip hop. I'm not looking to slam you, Ason, but there's some massive resistance to letting a hip hop artist develop over the long run and build a catalog and a career. What should Ghostface do, shoot himself because he's been around for more than five years? He's been in the game three years less than Jeff Tweedy, but nobody's asking for his retirement.
Most of the hip hop I buy is indie stuff, for the record, so it's not like I don't know that there's a whole world out there. (Unfortunately I don't have edited versions, so they are not a big part of the Best Show). But I don't dump on guys like Ghost or Jay-Z just because they're still doing it.
Let the guys in their 30's do their thing, son.
Tom.
Oh no
trust me I'm getting older myself I want to hear the older voices. GFK album sucked specifically because I think he was trying to appeal to teenagers and the mainstream. At this point I expect Starks to be crazier than ever carving out a niche with his stream of consciousness flows, bizarre storytelling and witticisms. Not paint by the numbers crack rap. MF Doom seems to me to have the right idea. He's having more success and name recognition than ever in a long career his reaction? To become even more insular.
Music it seems to me is always advanced by the outsiders being so awesome
that mainstream is forced to acknowledge and adapt to them.
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i'm glad you asked....your comment is so pompous i think it's probably a joke, so excuse me for seriously responding to it seriously if so. first of all, claiming that saul williams and k-os are doing more prolific work than wu tang, ghostface, jay z automatically disqualifies (or at least discredits) you from critiquing anything hip hop. saul williams has been floundering for years. k-os has done some nice work, but has done so little for hip hop in comparison to these other guys you seemingly slam, because they've taken more press. they're not even doing to same type of work first of all. sounds like you dig the posi stuff rather than street. if that's the issue, just say so.
i did a little college radio show ason. i've seen plenty of people who rep unknowns, sometimes it's justified, sometimes not. this time, your guys don't even count as unknowns, and its totally unjustified.
Well I'm a pompous kind of guy. Saul Williams + K-Os aren't as prolific no, but they are working towards expanding the boundaries of the genre. I grew up in a age where there wasn't a distinction between street and whatever and I refuse to look at things that way. I think you're either advancing or standing still.
In context of TS and the Best Show we're talking about an audience that will listen to blazing rock like the Blood Brothers, Set Fire To The Face On Fire. I find it disappointing someone might think to follow that up with Jay-Z's mumbling soul less boasting.
Jay-Z is another one that guy has been a parasite on east coast rap, he just sticks around and sticks around
dude has as much soul as an accountant. He rode the trends out and has tremendous material wealth because of it...I guess that should be celebrated but not in a musical context give him a spread in the Wall Street Journal or something.
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Pfft, that Saul Williams album is stupid poetry slam garbage. It's like somebody took a real rap album shopping for accessories at Hot Topic.
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Pfft, that Saul Williams album is stupid poetry slam garbage. It's like somebody took a real rap album shopping for accessories at Hot Topic.
I wasn't going to say anything because I am trying to judge less on stuff that is a matter of taste, but that Saul Williams album sounded like some HBO slam poetry over a bad NIN album.
Seriously, TR, does everything you touch have to sound like that?
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He's been in the game three years less than Jeff Tweedy, but nobody's asking for his retirement.
Tom.
I hereby call for Jeff Tweedy to retire.
But then again, I'm a Jay Farrar Man myself. Through and through.
I'm a Ricky Fataar man myself.
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I'm a Jamie Farr man. Or am I supposed to go more esoteric?
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Car Man, he's good.
"You know what else (Skillet Man) sprays that Pam on?
"What?"
"Guess."
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My favorite new rap album is The Art of Storytelling by Slick Rick. :-\
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My favorite new rap album is The Art of Storytelling by Slick Rick. :-\
Absolutely! One of the best
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8 Diagrams...best album of the year. Yeah, there are a few weak tracks. So many great ones though. RZA's production is always amazing and this album is RZA at his best.
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stick me for my riches is my current fav
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I'm pretty sure his name is Paul Williams.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v642/alembic14/PaulWilliams1.jpg)
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I'm pretty sure his name is Paul Williams.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v642/alembic14/PaulWilliams1.jpg)
C'mon, Lamont. Everyone knows Paul Williams' slam poetry is awesome.
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8 Diagrams is a snooze. Big Doe Rehab, on the other hand...
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8 Diagrams is a snooze. Big Doe Rehab, on the other hand...
Listen to it a couple more times. It took me about 3 listens but now I'm totally in love with it. It's certainly nothing like any other Wu-Tang CD but I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Could have used fewer instrumental breaks and a little less singing, but other than that I think it's great. I think 8 Diagrams is going to be the new "ending of Sopranos".
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I think 8 Diagrams is going to be the new "ending of Sopranos".
I've heard three tracks so far and they sounded like mid-season 4 Sopranos at best. Nevertheless, that comment prompted this pointless exercise:
Tony Soprano = RZA (the abbot)
Silvio Dante = GZA (the consiglierie or whatever)
Paulie Walnuts = Ghostface Killah (the most awesome)
Christopher = Method Man (always high)
Big Pussy = Raekwon (uhm...?)
Ralph Cifaretto = OBD ODB (crazy; doomed)
Baccala = Inspectah Deck (kicks the truth to the young black youth)
Furio = Masta Killa (barely talks/raps)
Patsy Parisi = U-God (no one cares)
Vito = Cappadonna (way too much screen/mic time)
And Uncle Junior is like the Sugarhill Gang or something.
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Furio = Masta Killa (barely talks/raps)
And don't forget the great song on his solo album, "You gotta bee onna you hat!"
Also, your Inspectah Deck/Bobby Baccala connection is genius*.
*Not THE Genius.
edit: Oh yeah, and I wanted to mention that once I did a similar comparative post with Wu-Tang and the Comedians of Comedy on AST.
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8 Diagrams is a snooze. Big Doe Rehab, on the other hand...
Listen to it a couple more times. It took me about 3 listens but now I'm totally in love with it. It's certainly nothing like any other Wu-Tang CD but I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Could have used fewer instrumental breaks and a little less singing, but other than that I think it's great. I think 8 Diagrams is going to be the new "ending of Sopranos".
I kind of liked that song with all the singing. It was ballsy. Really, the whole album was and RZA pulled it off even with two members of his group at his throat.
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"Stick me for my riches" = amazing. I love the whole album.
I'm baffled as to why "watch your mouth" wasn't on the album. When I first heard that song I didn't know what to think of it...the second time I heard it it became an all-time favorite.
You go get 'em Wu-Tang!!!
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My favorite new rap album is The Art of Storytelling by Slick Rick. :-\
how bout that pete rock
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Somebody posted this on Okayplayer and it's a perfect
illustration of how I feel about the state of rap and arguments I have with people
about the music all the time.
http://bunyanchopshop.blogspot.com/2007/12/rude-jude-ra-on-shade45_17.html
*some naughty language*
I'm on RA's side in case anybody was wondering
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so Wu Tang is pop?
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also, nothing like having a song on Tony Hawks Underground to get yourself some street cred, R.A.
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I'm not a big Ruggedman fan but he totally pwned Rude Jude. That West Coast vs. East Coast stuff is stupid. Just because Hammer wasn't as famous before You Can't Touch This doesn't mean he wasn't terrible. Next you're gonna tell me Kool Mo Dee wasn't crappy.
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I understand his point but anyone who says that they never liked anything that's not cool now is a liar.